Thanks for your help and I am signing off

A place for you to announce your upcoming wedding.

Moderators: zookie, Mrs J

Re: Thanks for your help and I am signing off

Postby be64 » Tue Sep 06, 2016 10:20 pm

If the chruch isn't true, what do you expect the life after this to be like, or are you going to end at death?
be64
 
Posts: 1880
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:02 am

Re: Thanks for your help and I am signing off

Postby HighDriveMormon » Tue Sep 06, 2016 10:41 pm

The lack of understanding or knowledge of the next life is what the church preys on to create loyalty to the church. The hope that comes from the "plan of salvation" and "eternal families" and seeing previously deceased love ones again, and the fear of losing family or suffering in the next life is why the church is able to gain such a loyal following.

I am completely okay not knowing what is going to happen, including the reality that there may be nothing. I am at peace following my feelings, conscience and logic than putting my faith in men who were literally and actually married dozens of women, including 14 to 16 year olds and already married women who had their husbands shipped off on missions just prior, and sleeping with almost all of them! Trust me, when you open yourself up to all the truth of the church, not just the version taught by the church, it is clear that the church is not true. If it walks like a cult, if it smells like a cult, if it looks like a cult, it is probably a cult.

I am agnostic now and actually find it enlightening and invigorating. I now try to live every day to the fullest, view life as something to be experienced rather than constrained within very narrow confines and find I have had more happiness, joy, amazing experiences, close relationships and genuine growth, and less anxiety, stress, depression and guilt, in these last two years since leaving than all the other years combined.
HighDriveMormon
 
Posts: 835
Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2011 7:52 am

Re: Thanks for your help and I am signing off

Postby JustGettingBy » Tue Sep 06, 2016 10:52 pm

My intent is not to persuade anybody to leave. If someone wants to ask a question then private message me.
User avatar
JustGettingBy
 
Posts: 1608
Joined: Thu Jun 26, 2008 8:29 pm

Re: Thanks for your help and I am signing off

Postby be64 » Tue Sep 06, 2016 10:55 pm

This thread essentially confirms what I said in a post here years ago when first coming here that this is mostly a group of apostates posing as active members. It's just that the apoststes are no longer posing.
be64
 
Posts: 1880
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:02 am

Re: Thanks for your help and I am signing off

Postby HighDriveMormon » Tue Sep 06, 2016 11:04 pm

I first logged on here 5 or 7 years ago. Just left two years ago. Taught at mtc for three years and was poster boy for the church until I left. Definitely wasn't an apostate. But I would agree that most free thinking, logical, open minded people are leaving the church. You can label us apostates, just as I can label you a sheep, or simple minded or needing a crutch to give your life value. Labeling me and others apostate is extremely judgmental and condenscending, but that is the only way most church members can justify their existence and find value in their lives...
HighDriveMormon
 
Posts: 835
Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2011 7:52 am

Re: Thanks for your help and I am signing off

Postby be64 » Wed Sep 07, 2016 12:11 am

I hope you enjoy the view from that great and spacious building. The Book of Mormon truely is prophetic.
be64
 
Posts: 1880
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:02 am

Re: Thanks for your help and I am signing off

Postby cmfray » Wed Sep 07, 2016 1:49 am

HD, your comments fascinate me, make me feel insulted and defensive, all at the same time. How do you do that so well?

NO good comes from lumping people in one unflattering category and we all know it's not true, wether it be Mormons, non Mormons, ex Mormons, people on this forum or any other group of people.

Careful with the drinking. I have several family members who have ruined their lives and hurt others because of alcohol and other substances that impaired their judgements and took over control of their lives. Just recently buried a young one whose early death was avoidable and unnecessary. Now I get to watch his son adjust to life without his father. So this topic is a sore spot with me right now. Be careful with your freedom, lest you unwittingly give it away. Not saying you will nor that everyone who drinks ends up this way. Just saying be careful - that's all.

Enough said - I must return to my depressing needy cultish world - put my naive mindset back on so I can seek comfort through my dreams of my happy eternal life hereafter.

WHATEVER!!!
cmfray
 
Posts: 1880
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2011 7:23 pm

Re: Thanks for your help and I am signing off

Postby HighDriveMormon » Wed Sep 07, 2016 2:25 am

be64 wrote:I hope you enjoy the view from that great and spacious building. The Book of Mormon truely is prophetic.


Please enlighten me in what ways specifically. Making generic bold statements that something is true does not in fact make it true. I've probably read the bom more than most people on here, I attended all three goes of church for over 30 years, I attended byu for 7 years and taught at the mtc for three. I know what the lds church is from a members perspective. I also spent time researching the church from a neural and outsiders perspective. Have you done that? Go read the ces letter at cesletter.com and let me know if you still believe.

CM,it's a gift ;) I appreciate your words and warning about drinking. Seriously. But I have also learned the church has installed the fear of God into its members that drinking results in alcoholism which results in misery and death. I have hundreds of not thousands of friends who drink and almost all of them seem to be very much in control. We primarily reserve drinking for dates, special nights or vacation. We've made a few mistakes, but we've learned from it and really enjoy it now. Isn't that what life is all about? Learning from mistakes and growing and maturing? Also, if you knew s personally, you'd know we participate in obstacle course races and other races almost every month, work out 5 to 6 days per week, eat healthy 5 or 6 days per week and my wife is even considering fitness bikini competing. We are healthier than 99% of active Mormons who don't drink alcohol but will feast on soda and sugary foods while avoiding any form of exercise. Christy can verify as she has seen some of our profiles and photos.

A question for you believers. The lds church teaches that once you know the truth, you have to share it to the world, especially to those you love. Assuming I know that the church isn't true, and is just a cult/scam, wouldn't the same thing apply? I try to be respectful of others but have the lds church and its teachings shoved down my throat every day here in Utah. Yet the second I bring up a true fact or concern, it is considered disrespectful or rude or offensive. I would never spread lies or false information but will share doubts and facts and concerns. It would be nice to engage in a real conversation with members willing to look at all the truth.

Only looking at the information as shared by the church leaders is like only listening to what politicians say about themselves,etc. keep in mind hitler was worshipped as a savior of Germany for almost a decade before the truth came out. Truth is truth, and anyone afraid to look at the truth cannot say they know something to be true.
HighDriveMormon
 
Posts: 835
Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2011 7:52 am

Re: Thanks for your help and I am signing off

Postby cmfray » Wed Sep 07, 2016 3:34 am

Final comments - I promise!

Leaving the church does not always lead to a rosy pretty outcome anymore than staying in the church leads to an unhappy depressed outcome.

People are people - some happy, some depressed, some kind, some mean, etc, etc, - in all groups, all religions, all races, etc etc.

I know many free thinking, intelligent, open minded people choosing to stay in the church. And I have seen many close minded, not so intelligent, followers leaving the church.
cmfray
 
Posts: 1880
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2011 7:23 pm

Re: Thanks for your help and I am signing off

Postby cmfray » Wed Sep 07, 2016 4:20 am

Ok, you baited me, HD. Truth is truth you say, facts are facts you say. When talking about history, especially long term history, whose version is truth and who gets to determine what the evidence means. Three historians can look at what they believe is a fact based on the evidence they find and interpret that fact three different ways. Are their determinations fact or opinion? That's the problem with history. Even two people witnessing something in person can have different versions of what happened.

Religions are not based on fact and truths - as defined by world standards. You can not tell me it is a fact that there is no God, and I can not tell you it is a fact that there is one. You say read the ces letter and see the truth. I have read it, parts of it several times. I would wager I have read everything you have read that has led you to your conclusion. Yet my conclusion is different. Why? Am I dumb, gullible, incapable of seeing the truth you see? Could not the same be said about you.?

I am not trying to argue with you or put you down. You have your life to live and have to do what you believe is right for you. I don't doubt that you deal with a lot of flack and prejudice for your beliefs, especially in Utah. But are you doing the same to those who chose to believe?

I do not believe it is so simple that you can say truth is truth and fact is fact - not concerning religion which is not based on worldly scientific fact and truth definitions. You say you would like to have an open discussion with believers, what is the purpose of your discussion.

There are things that sometimes discussions just don't work well with. Religion and politics are definitely two of those things in my opinion. When people are set in their beliefs and only want to change the others view point to theirs, discussions turn into debates, often angry ones.

But that does not mean you can't be friends and get along with those who believe differently There is room for different opinions, we just have to make an agreement that it is Ok to disagree and allow others the same right to their beliefs as we expect to have with ours.
cmfray
 
Posts: 1880
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2011 7:23 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Announcements

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron